e-branch idea

[KnotMe]

So I was looking at the latest KM branch notes and thinking of the synergy and inspiration you get from meeting people face to face, interacting in real-time.  In the back of my mind was blather about technology changing the world and such.  In particular Google Hangouts because it's (1) free and runs on most computers (and tablets and phones) with minimal effort (2) both an interactive and broadcast medium and (3) downloads to Youtube automatically.

So, I'd like to start an e-branch.  It can be official (the IGKT has a largely unused Google+ page) or unaffiliated (I can host).  We can start independently and move to official later if the council wishes time to mull, also.

To give us a time and date to think (argue!  ) about, I propose first Sunday of the month 10am Pacific Standard Time (GMT-8 ) starting March 3, 2013.
To foster free sharing and discussion, I further propose there be 2 meetings in sequence.  First a half hour (45 mins?) meeting that will be closed for members only to discuss organization stuff, lining up lecturers or teachers for subsequent meetings or whatever, and if people want to share, but only with the group.  Then, a followup meeting that will be broadcast to the world at large.  Both hangouts can then be published to Youtube, the first one privately, the second public.

Further ideas spring up about different languages, multiple meetings to accommodate more time zones, and, and, and...  but start small-ish and build, right? 

[Mrs Glenys Chew]

Hi,


Sweeney and Squarerigger would know best if you need to have permission from the Council.  I hope it goes well.  Technology has not only bcome more amenable to hosting such a meeting, but also affordable enough to overcome the problems we had seven years ago, when the chatroom was struggling for participation.


Glenys

[squarerigger]

Carol,

Some personal thoughts (not to be construed as representing the Council's views):  The establishment of an e-Branch is one that requires population and participation at the same time.  Branches are great for sharing and cross-pollination of ideas for knots in face-to-face meetings, because something physical can be shared.  Our current Constitution and Rules do not specify that a Branch shall have a physical location so the Council would have to make the decision about whether or not to adopt such a Branch type.  Who do you know that would wish (apart from yourself Carol) to take part and what equipment would be required of each participant?  Here I am thinking about cameras, still and video, and microphones and speakers (with which many computers are fitted today) together with minimum resolution limits if necessary.  Would there need to be a limit to the size of the participating community and would there be any democratic process involved or would this be the first or fastest shouter who got the last word?  Meeting times are easy to establish but may be difficult for some to share.  Would this present any difficulties for potential participants?  How do you foresee that process working?  Let me know please.

Lindsey

[KnotMe]

Some personal thoughts (not to be construed as representing the Council's views)

Noted.

Who do you know that would wish (apart from yourself Carol) to take part

Based on the echoing silence that greeted my post, it sounds an awful lot like I'm alone in wanting to try this.

and what equipment would be required of each participant?

A 'net connection, a web camera of some kind and a microphone would be the baseline.  I have done hangouts with my computer (Mac), tablet and phone (separately).  If you're going to effectively show a project, some practice might be in order to see if the camera fixed to the top of your computer will do the trick (framing, background and such) or if you need a separate camera source (phone or movable webcam).  Speakers are actually less desirable because they can cause feedback.  Better would be to have headphones.

together with minimum resolution limits if necessary

Hangout system requirements
http://support.google.com/plus/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=1216376&topic=1651183&ctx=topic

Would there need to be a limit to the size of the participating community and would there be any democratic process involved or would this be the first or fastest shouter who got the last word?

The limit to voice and video participants is 10.  However, Hangouts on Air seems to be available to all now (except for China, Thailand and Vietnam), so the number of viewers is effectively unlimited and those can participate through comments.  Also, people can be switched in and out (no idea how smooth that process is). 

While it's true that camera focus goes to whoever is speaking at the moment, I think there are some moderation tools to control things somewhat.

Meeting times are easy to establish but may be difficult for some to share.  Would this present any difficulties for potential participants?  How do you foresee that process working?  Let me know please.

Well, if any one else had anything to say about meeting times, I would be happy to coordinate and mediate.  My initial expectation is that North America and Europe are the bulk of the IGKT so daylight in those areas and a weekend time would be optimal to start.  My hope is that participation and population would eventually become so great that multiple meetings would be required.    Until then, however, people that want to participate and can't make the agreed upon time for that month can pre-record contributions if so desired.  I already mentioned archiving the meetings for later viewing by members and/or the world.

Honestly, though.  Getting all formal at this point seems unnecessary and counter productive.  All that's needed, IMHO, is one other participant (more most welcome!) to work out procedures and any system quirks and do a proof of concept (sure, I could bribe my sweetie or kids to do that with me, but if I can't get even one of you to express some interest, what's the point?) then take a "if you build it they will come" attitude to the process. 

[Sweeney]

Sounds a good idea - certainly worth a try. I think I would avoid the name "Branch" at least to start with - the Guild has some Branches which are formally constituted (eg PAB) but most groups are not Branches but simply members getting together informally which is what I think is intended here. Anyway whatever we call this the important thing is to give it a go on a small scale to sort out the practical problems and then move on from there.

Barry

[KnotMe]

Sounds a good idea - certainly worth a try. I think I would avoid the name "Branch" at least to start with...give it a go on a small scale to sort out the practical problems and then move on from there.

I'm fine with that.  So, I've made (an event) and we can see what happens...

[Sweeney]

It's taken a couple of days before the link worked. I've shown myself as a "maybe" but I'll certainly make every effort to join in (got a streaming cold at the moment but I don't think Google+ can transmit that virus yet but give them time.......!.)

Barry

[KnotMe]

It's taken a couple of days before the link worked.

How odd.  I wonder why that is...

I've shown myself as a "maybe" but I'll certainly make every effort to join in (got a streaming cold at the moment but I don't think Google+ can transmit that virus yet but give them time.......!.)

Excellent.  I've got 2 maybes at this point.  I'll get my show and tell all organized.   

[KnotMe]

Reminding those considering the idea, the meeting will be tomorrow at 10am PST.  We've got 4 maybe's and 2 confirmed, woot!   

[KnotMe]

this is the hangout https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/e7255260a1f32e482d24a6fe547e3fa1badee550?authuser=0&eid=113735071644470240986&hl=en

alas i could not make it public as i had included people who responded but were not in my circle.  i will debug better next time.  still, if you come to my profile, https://plus.google.com/107945476213341647743/ i should be able to invite you (i hope).

this is also being streamed to my youtube, as i understand it but it's not public.  :huh:

I did do a test, but these problems didn't happen then. 

[KnotMe]

So, in the end there were only three of us, but we had an excellent and wide ranging discussion about knots, although no actual show-and-tell, except for the contents of Barry's pockets   but we're definitely trying again.

To start with, i think I was caught in this problem http://www.videoleadsonline.com/hangouts-and-google-plus-events-a-bad-combination/ and will endeavor to fix it for next time.  More extensive testing needs to be done.

On the less technical side of things, I (West Coast, Canada), Barry (UK), and Mao (not his real name, I'm terrible with names, sorry!!!  in Taiwan) were, if you do the calculations exactly equidistant around the globe (timezone wise).  8 hours apart each.

If we three are the core, then I propose I take the night shift, as for me it would be Saturday/Sunday morning=>no work in the morning) vs Sunday/Monday morning as it was for Mao.  The problem with that idea is that the timing starts to suck for more east-ward North Americans (should they chose to participate).  Pulling it back to be more reasonable for them, means that the European contingent needs to be more morning-ish (and committing to get up at 10am on Sunday morning was something I had to consider for a while, it being my catch-up day.  Late is not an issue for me 

I'm going to suggest 12am PDT Sunday April 7th as the next meeting time.  We will, of course adjust if that timing is inconvenient for you, just say so!

Suggested  topics (I'll put up a poll if we get any response or other suggestions) of
(1) making a teaching display, basic knots they should know
(2) making "high tech" knots.  What does that mean to you?