Author Topic: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted  (Read 2428 times)

enhaut

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A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« on: September 07, 2022, 02:29:23 AM »
Sometimes straightforward methods pay off.

In the next two posts, I am revisiting an old friend. Ashley's #1032 is considered by the author as handsome and secure.

A long time ago in a post about helicoidal loops, I pointed out to Xarax that #1032 was in fact a helicoidal nipping loop, he agreed.

Here using a process involving racking turns and round turns (see extract) I guide the outgoing leg to a nice seizing route. The original loop treated this way is now a more secure alternative without losing the handsomeness factor.

Looking at the structure, I realized that this idea can be used as a hitching device (see picture).With the outgoing end, I just went under the first round turn to add more grip and security.I am curious about the limits of this proposition.

Below in the next post I exploit a similar outgoing pattern with a crossing knot nipping structure to obtain a TIB loop.

enhaut

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2022, 02:31:23 AM »
Here the first outgoing round turn seize just one rode diameter.
This TIB loop is also EEL.
Let's name it Gower nipper Loop

Kost_Greg

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2022, 08:06:35 PM »
Nice tying techniques that upgrade the security level of the parent knots without being short on the esthetic quality as well.

Brilliant hitching idea, i'll have to consult Xarax, if he possesses anything like this in his arsenal, as i am curius about its practical aspect.

I understand you didn't find Xarax's plait loop so good (or its reverse the Samisen prime bowline), so you provide additional round turn enhancement for more nub stabillity i assume? ;)  (i'm refering to the Gower nipper loop). The tibness is not affected by this amendment.

I wouldn't mind at all if the middle turn (reply#1, third image for a clear view), would glide a bit taking the form of a collar encircling both ends, for an alternate dressing. Either way, the tug end is firmly secured.

I consider Plait and Samisen prime, the most decent stabilization techniques for the various unstable, crossing knot states, but this pattern is pretty good too, or even more stable with a cost of some extra complexity.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2022, 01:17:45 PM by Kost_Greg »
Going knots

alanleeknots

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2022, 02:19:29 PM »

                       Can anyone post some pictures of "Xarax's plait loop" "Samisen prime bowline"
                         Thanks,  alanleeknots.

SS369

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« Last Edit: October 05, 2022, 04:12:09 PM by SS369 »

alanleeknots

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2022, 07:20:42 PM »

                  Scott, Thank you very much. You have great days.

enhaut

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2022, 07:23:05 PM »
@Kost_Greg
@everybody

"Captain Richard Hall Gower (1768?1833) was an English mariner, empirical philosopher, nautical inventor, entrepreneur, and humanitarian."
Gower link;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Hall_Gower

 The term Gower Loop emerged when searching for a loop's name using the racking turns technique that once Mr.Gower found to be a sound practice.(see notes 3118 to 3121 in ABOK)

 There is one similarity between the Plait Loop and the Gower proposition but putting them in the same family is far-fetched, in my opinion.

Both emerge from an overhand nipping construct that's it.

 The Plait's outgoing leg forms a collar then links with the nip in an overhand fashion before exiting along the standing part.
The nip encompasses 2 rope diameter.

 The Gower's outgoing leg performs 3 round turn before exiting. There is no collar as such but the racking turns replace this function.
The nip encompasses 4 rope diameter. 
 
 The orderly raking turns are the essence to this nub; pulling up the middle turn as you suggest forming a collar is contrary to the technique I choose and frankly the result is lacking merit.

Quote
Brilliant hitching idea, i'll have to consult Xarax, if he possesses anything like this in his arsenal, as i am curius about its practical aspect.

Brilliant idea yes thanks and in fact this concept is expendable more knots can be derived from this concept.

See the Nipper Hitch here;
https://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=7360.0

Imagine you have no carabiner at hand and you need hoisting a tool to your friend arborist at the top of the tree. This hitch does the trick.

Xarax did a number of hitches during a period. He used pipes as a primary hosting device, that gave us beautiful pictures when he used transparent host. He could not have come up with the concept explore here unless he had a plumber's abilities. (see image)

Image = Plait and Gower

Top frame;        Plait Loop (rear view)
I have used the Plait loop depicts in reply #1 in the link post provide by SS369.

Bottom frame;  Gower Loop (rear view)

Image = A candy for Xarax
Hypothetical set-up for a lab dedicated to hitches.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2022, 07:26:09 PM by enhaut »

alanleeknots

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2022, 11:23:49 PM »
         
               enhaut,
                           Nice work, creative idea. Here I have a knot the incoming eye leg going in difference direction.
                           please 12:50" of this video    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzd20UIY4JU&t=760s
                                    Thanks.

enhaut

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2022, 09:31:23 PM »
@alanleeknots

Very interesting video where you arrived at a classic #1032 and a #1032 enhanced with ease as it is always the case you with.

The sequence between 4:18 and 4:40 caught my attention.
Thanks.

Image = from the link video by alanleeknots

At left the #1032 enhanced (the pattern before exiting is different from the one on the right of the frame)
« Last Edit: October 12, 2022, 09:32:05 PM by enhaut »

Kost_Greg

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Re: A decorative Chinese Loop Revisted
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2022, 10:37:47 PM »
@Enhaut

It didn't seem so far fetched at that time, when i removed the middle section of your knot (knot segment bordered by the ellipsis), following exactly the same pattern to the rest of the maneuver, where the plait/Samisen came out of nowhere.

Pardon my usual practice to fiddle with most of the knots i encounter, especially those with a rather bulky appearence, trying to eliminate the complexity, in order to find out what lies beneath, perhaps the realization of a more simplified form that i can gain an understanding of it.

What i did was rather arbitrary, when i removed part of the knot and replaced it with just a line. The knots in question, are completely different geometrically and functionally, and i totally understand the concept of the racking turns.

Quote
Xarax did a number of hitches during a period. He used pipes as a primary hosting device, that gave us beautiful pictures when he used transparent host. He could not have come up with the concept explore here unless he had a plumber's abilities.

I wouldn't be so sure if i were you, as i have seen Xarax's hitches tied on his plumbing pipes around his house, you never know what he is capable of.  ;)
« Last Edit: October 12, 2022, 10:40:43 PM by Kost_Greg »
Going knots

 

anything