Author Topic: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?  (Read 2534 times)

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« on: May 13, 2022, 11:44:40 PM »
i seem to have converted to cotton!
photos of work from asemery steered me in that direction.
it's interesting to work with,
i was excited to find some local-made (domestic) rope and cord,
plus i became leery of synthetics, after seeing a little bit of paracord disintegrating after a few years.
the thought of having to whip all ends was a deterrent but i took the plunge and it's not too bad :)
and fussing over a project is just part of the craft. and more knot tying!
also 20% p.v.a glue is working great

i bought the wrong stuff to start with, it was 4-ply twisted rope and it wasn't as tightly twisted as i expected. anyway i've got the braided stuff and it's the pick.

pre-shrinking bits and pieces is fiddly.
can i just ... leave it on the roll and throw the hot water on it?
just as i'm asking, i think it might set the cord in a roll shape, with a curve in the whole batch... 

interested in what those who've gone before have observed  ☺ 
« Last Edit: May 13, 2022, 11:48:09 PM by alana »

SS369

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2009
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2022, 12:35:35 AM »
Some cotton cord is treated with various things. I think submerging the roll won't allow the water to penetrate fully. Some of the braided cotton cord have a synthetic core.
Probably best to tie and then shrink perhaps.
When I use cotton, depending what I am tying, I like to wax the cord and tie it snug.

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2022, 03:41:57 AM »
🔥
great points,
thanks,
saving me from some tales of woe!
yes, the cord has some scotchgard on it, or something.

i used to drive through rural areas
which included a cotton farming area,
and stray cotton boll fragments were on the road - but not many -
maybe 150 pieces on a kilometre.
anyway, i'm just really liking the new material  😊

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2022, 05:32:23 AM »
separate from the 3mm and 4mm cotton cord on the rolls in first post,
i bought a comparative heap of locally manufactured cotton cord,
believing it to be australian cotton,

no, it's spanish origin cotton,
which would be okay except that also means it could be from india,
which would also be fine it was a fabric to make a shirt...

so it was one-third the price of home grown cotton,

i encouraged the cord maker to produce with australian cotton,
it's kind of expensive ... but i've paid a lot more to get a lot less
and keen to buy local! 

this particular purchase is bundled relaxedly into a paper collar, no cardboard roll,
and i have pre-shrunk some, with ease.

can anyone advise on putting offcut (thread bits) into the compost bin?

the shop owner mentioned people leaving some thread out for birds to make nests with - how cute! it'd be a soft and colourful nest  😊
« Last Edit: May 19, 2022, 05:37:19 AM by alana »

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2022, 05:35:40 AM »
and i found out about oeko-tex,
a certification body that grades cottons.

i hope this cotton lasts for decades,
that's why i jumped ship from nylon ! ☺

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2022, 09:55:53 AM »
Some cotton cord is treated with various things. I think submerging the roll won't allow the water to penetrate fully. Some of the braided cotton cord have a synthetic core.
Probably best to tie and then shrink perhaps.
When I use cotton, depending what I am tying, I like to wax the cord and tie it snug.

alright,
how do i WAX cotton, if i really must!   :)
without iinstructions i will likely just make a mess.
in my cotton happy trails it's been fun learning all about it.

another thing useful for temporary tying of ends is  ... the cotton string on tea bags!,
it's the right length,
pretty strong,,
is getting thrown out with the tag anyway,
so ... more cotton.





SS369

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2009
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2022, 02:24:24 PM »
It can depend on how waxy you want it and how much effort you want to invest.
For small diameter cord you could just pull it across a block of beeswax, or safely melt the wax (in a double boiler) and draw it through a cloth, wiping the wax off as you do.
It will stiffen the cord a bit and darken some.
If it is purely ornamental, you can "paint it" with some diluted white glue.

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2022, 11:58:57 PM »
It can depend on how waxy you want it and how much effort you want to invest.
For small diameter cord you could just pull it across a block of beeswax, or safely melt the wax (in a double boiler) and draw it through a cloth, wiping the wax off as you do.
It will stiffen the cord a bit and darken some.
If it is purely ornamental, you can "paint it" with some diluted white glue.
Quote

nice,
thanks so much ss

i know what i'm doing this weekend!

i actually don't know what i'm trying to achieve here but will see the effects and options  :)
« Last Edit: June 09, 2022, 12:01:00 AM by alana »

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2022, 12:36:49 PM »
resharpen razor blades

alright i'm a bit joyous to discover that double edge razor blades resharpen on a usual sharpening steel   :D  woohoo!

this is great, cause recently - since using pvc glue on cotton - i didn't want to blunt my scissors on trimming cotton with dried glue in it.
then i remembered i had a folding straight razor that used half blades, sitting unused in a box of miscellaneous unused stuff.
it always had a slight bend in it so i never used it.

anyway, i was gleeful to now put it to use,
but, wow the blades blunt quickly.
i pictured an upcoming expenditure on new blades,
then thought why not try sharpen it (like i do with snap off blades) -
it works great
and now i won't have to buy more blades for quite some time   :)

this'll also be great in trimming synthetics

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2022, 03:26:10 AM »
and the next problematic issue is the glue on cut ends being unpleasant, like a piece of gravel on a soft knotted item. the cotton is almost plush, then the glue bits on the ends are harsh

what would be ideal is a softer silicone sealant which dries a bit more pliable.
but only need a small amount,
looking for a form of it ... 🔍

anyway, here's a lobster i've tied! 

« Last Edit: June 17, 2022, 05:22:11 AM by alana »

wysper

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 45
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2022, 05:31:18 AM »
Hi Alana,

I haven't thought about trying to find a glue like that. But I did a quick google and I came across this.
https://www.loctiteproducts.com/en/products/specialty-products/specialty/loctite_vinyl_fabricplasticflexibleadhesive.html
I haven't used it before but it might do the trick.

You suggested a silicone sealant and that might work but I am not sure how well it would stick to fabric.

Cheers
Greg

mcjtom

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 175
    • Phototramp.com
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2022, 06:43:29 AM »
 There is a glue/sealant that I can't live without since I discovered it, not necessarily for ropes.  It behaves a little like silicone when set, but it's much stronger, especially adhesion-wise.  UHU and Henkel/Pattex both sell 8g tubes, which I believe are identical but the availability depends on the country.

https://www.uhu.com/en/glueing-activities/diy-and-repair/repair/max-repair

https://www.amazon.com/Pattex-Repair-Extreme-Glue-Tube/dp/B01102XEJA

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2022, 05:30:09 AM »
 ℹ 🎯
thanks so much for these quality leads! 
.
.
a few hours later ...

there's quite a range of silicone sealants / adhesives in thumb-sized tubes ..!
in the back of my mind was always the above-mentioned concerns of availability and of stickability to fabric, plus the likelihood of the unused contents just curing uncontrollably and going to waste in the tube.

i tested some vinyl repair paint from a kit of various colours,
i guess it would be much like a silicone sealant consistency.
well, it has to be buttered on with a spatula, too much fussing,
and it doesn't absorb in the ends like a glue does. (pic white)

so i began barking up the 'fabric glue' tree,
in short, i've ordered helmar brand fabric glue, clear,
if it doesn't suit perfectly, it'll at least be a decent craft glue

lobster feet and cotton cord terminals.
i managed to unravel the end of a braided cord,
and tie each of the ends together - works great,
except it only unravels one way,
and there is still a harsh lump terminal formed
(lime green)

i also thought i could simply ease up on the pvc glue,
glue just a couple of mm, instead of 5mm+
(mid green)

also, i tried candle wax,
it was pretty good!,
just not as controllable as glue,
but i was wowed with the effect

silicone good for wind-proofing 😊
in a previous life as a window assembler,
i might've blown through a tube a day of sealant.
anyway i had an old pair of jeans that i wanted to try wind-proofing.
i trowelled on a single layer of silicone to the front leg panels,
and it worked great,
as good as leather, riding to work,
and warm in winter.
winning! 
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 06:54:16 AM by alana »

alana

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 121
  • knot fever, knot fever
    • knots a.f
Re: cotton! and how to pre-shrink?
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2022, 06:06:12 AM »
helmar 'wash n wear' glue
(purple label)

i'm gladdened to gladness to say that the fabric glue is successful,
mentioned from the start, by wysper

there's two fabric glues in the helmar range,
i didn't know which would be best ,
so i bought both, 'wash n wear' and 'fabric glue' 125mL
this is called pay and pray.

i cut the cotton cord to the particular length + 2mm,
tied off to the wanted line by cotton thread constrictor knot,
dipped each end into a shallow dish of the 'wash n wear' glue + 30% water,
about 5mm beyond the constrictor knot line
it goes on white and dries clear,
and soft!
i dried it overnight and trimmed with razor, on the cut line

very happy with the results,
water-based
strong grip when dried,
it dries flexible and slightly rubbery,
not scratchy finish as pva glue.
the hunt is over!
it's a perfect match

photo: lobster feet, soft terminals

part ii helmar 'fabric glue'

the other bottle simply called 'fabric glue',
has a smell like superglue,
and it dries fast!
almost unfeasibly fast
it still dries with flexibility,
maybe a little less flexible than the wash n wear,
i used it on the lobster antennae,
but the antennae have been whipped
so it's not an equal comparison,
so i can't yet comment accurately on the softness when it's fully cured
but so far showing signs of having strong adhesion,
like a flexible superglue in a bulk quantity. 

also i was thrilled to find it's an australian made product,
they export too, a range of chemicals,
i love australian manufactured quality gooods  😊🇦🇺