Nonsense : it appears and DOES attribute your words to you,
and those words echo someone's claim with an associated date
that is quite publicly contradicted as being *first/prior*.
I call nonsense on this.
I am not making a claim - I am reporting what has been openly published by others on the internet.
Bernd Strasser is openly associated with the Schwabisch hitch.
The question you need to ask - instead of attempting to denigrate - is whether the claim is true (or not).
You found an illustration in a book (On Rope) - and you want to use that as hard evidence against Bernd Strasser's attribution.
It
almost crosses the threshold of accusing someone of a crime!
I don't hold you as being that simple --elsewhere, you reach
for solid ground, not hearsay
Errrm, thanks for not holding me out as being "simple".
It looks prima facie : how else could it be seen?]
Yep - I'm guilty.
I am guilty of parroting information widely published on the internet.
If I am to be judged guilty of parroting information from the internet - what is the punishment?
What punishment would be befitting of this crime?
Quote
At pages 46-47 of 'On Rope' (1987), it is implied that Bob Thrun discovered
the 'Schwabisch hitch' (identified as; 3 coil, 4 coil, and 5 coil Prusik knots; all are illustrated).
It may very well be that Bob Thrun was the creator.
No, and no :: Bob commented on **imbalanced** such coil-gripping
versions,
No and No.
It is implied in the book (On Rope) and page 46, that the "three, four, and five coil hitches - are "After Thrun".
The words "after Thrun" are printed.
I guess it depends on how you wish to interpret the construction of these words (ie "after Thrun").
The words "after Thrun" may also be a reference to his 'Prusiking' book (which is out-of-print).
I dont have a copy of Thrun's Prusiking book.
...
At least Allen Padgett (in his Book 'On Rope') acknowledges the concept of tying a slide and grip hitch with access to a free end versus no access to a free end.
Which I refer to as 'TIB' - Tiable In the Bight.
That is, a Schwabisch is not 'TIB' because it cannot be formed around the mid-point of a host rope unless you have access to a free end.
(NOTE: Pre-forming the geometry of a Schwabisch hitch in your hand - and then inserting the
end of a host rope through the core of the hitch
is an artificial construct - that is simply not a real-world practical tying method).
...
Source of irritationTo summarise, your source of irritation is the claim from several sources on the internet that the Schwabisch hitch is attributed to Bernd Strasser.
Your irritation is then aimed at me for parroting what is openly published by many in the arborist industry.
I am happy to be the source of your irritation
Guilty verdictYes, I hereby declare my guilt.
I am guilty of parroting the claims about Bernd Strasser from the arborist industry - and I am guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
Bernd Strasser himself does not appear to
object to his own name being associated with the 'Schwabisch hitch'.
Perhaps he is also guilty?
Alternative history - sowing the seeds of doubt:Is it possible that Bernd Strasser made the discovery before Bob Thrun or others?
We have clear images published in Allen Padgett's book from 1987 - but what if Bernd Strasser actually made his discovery earlier, and then brought it to the attention of USA tree climbers.
Bernd is
German - and he travelled to the USA to compete in tree climbing competitions.
In his visits to the USA, I would surmise that he showed US tree climbers the 'Schwabisch hitch'.
It got noticed, people liked it, and then it got mentioned in an April 1998 publication of 'Arborist News'.
This does not mean he discovered the hitch in 1998.
It just means it finally got revealed to the USA in 1998.
This reminds me of the history of 'Blakes hitch' and the 'Munter hitch'.
Werner Munter did not discover the Munter hitch - he simply brought it to the attention of US climbers in the 1970's.
But, we know that it was already used as a load control belay hitch by Italians in the 1950's.
And, the Munter hitch was published by Ashley in 1944 - but not identified as a load control hitch.
NOTE: I define a 'load control hitch' as a structure where the rope flows around its host, and yet maintains its geometric form.
EDIT NOTE:With further regard to granting 'TIB' status to the Schwabisch hitch:
In my view, a slide and grip hitch can be declared 'TIB' if it can be formed around the mid-point of a host rope (without access to an end).
That is, the hitch can be tied without access to a free end.
And herein is the key underlying concept:
There must be
no access to any free end - either from the hitching cord or the host rope.
Therefore, inserting a free end of a host rope through a pre-formed hitch is 'cheating' - because you are by definition accessing a free end.
It must all be accomplished without access to
any free end.
I think this definition is workable and satisfactory - because it requires no access to any free end - of either the hitching cord or the host rope.
And since 'TIB' is generally understood to mean that a 'knot' can be tied and untied without access to an end - it seems logical.
Of course, this is my definition of a 'TIB' hitch. You may choose to disagree - and if you do, would be good to provide your coherent theory of an alternative view.