Author Topic: QuasiLocked Eye Knot  (Read 228 times)

SS369

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QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« on: November 29, 2024, 04:15:22 PM »
For consideration:
Something I devised back in 2021. Found the photo while doing some organizing.
Definitely secure in all directions.
Does take careful dressing and tightening.
Comments appreciated.

SS

agent_smith

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2024, 12:49:52 AM »
Thanks for your presentation Scott.

Good to see you using your 'Scotts lock' to make the structure stable and secure.
It reminds me of a 'woven' Bowline you presented many years ago.

I've always been a fanboy of your original 'Scotts locked Bowline' - and routinely use it
in life critical applications.

It is a quasi Bowline - having a nipping structure rather than a nipping loop.
Although I had to make sure that the nipping structure was in fact 'functional'.
The key conditions/rules for 'nipping loops/structures' are:
1. Must be 'TIB'
2. Must be loaded at both ends
3. Must be functional.
It took me a little while to confirm that functionality had not been compromised.

Quick analysis:
It is stable and secure and also resistant to jamming.
I'll go further and declare it to be inherently secure (in human rated ropes, EN892, EN1891, EN564).

However, it is unlikely to gain traction and popularity in the general roping community.

I don't recall it being presented before - so I think you have a legitimate claim of originality.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2024, 12:50:32 AM by agent_smith »

SS369

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2024, 01:26:28 PM »
Thanks for your comments Mark.

I have employed the tail lock maneuver with many constructs, not just eye knots. I believe it enhances security with the added complexity. (Not a complex action to perform though.)

I agree with your quick analysis and appreciate you taking the time and effort to share it.

Yes, I don't expect much traction to be gained by any large audience of users, but then, many of the knots being offered and explored are so complex and of no practicality, except perhaps furthering the understanding the mechanics involved, that they most likely will never be used.

It is nice looking though. Grin

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Kost_Greg

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2024, 08:39:21 PM »
Hello

It is clearly a retucked version of your prototype bowline with your well known locking maneuver.

Threading the eye through the nipping structure collar (not the bowline collar) establishes this correlation.

However, despite the security enhancement, there is also a nipping structure complexity upgrade of third level, which, in conjuction with the bowline collar placement in between the nipping loop and the out-going eye leg collar continuation, along with the three rope diameters, would cause severe friction conditions in your core, leaving no room for bowline collar decompression.

Swapping the collars would make at least the one more releasable.

Not sure if you have already investigated the second level of nipping structure complexity, using your lock or a yosemite finish.
Going knots

SS369

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2024, 09:10:04 PM »
Hello Kost_Greg, thank you for your comments.

Yes, the collar swap can ease the untying, although I haven't found my offering to be very difficult, except in highly compressible or thin media, (as with most knots). But, it does make it more susceptible to loosening, in my testing.
Friction in the core could be a two edged sword. One: It makes it more secure. Two: It could promote failure at extreme loading(s).

I have no current facility to test to destructive failure, but I have tightened it to what I consider unsafe limits including "ring loading" and as an inline eye knot.

Not sure what you mean by, "second level of complexity"?

I am of the opinion that anymore complexity may just be superfluous. Maybe even counter-productive.

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Kost_Greg

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2024, 09:35:09 PM »
Just a few clarifications about nipping structure's complexity.

1. First level, simple nipping loop (one twist), example:Scott's locked bowline.

2. Second level, crossing knot (two twists), example: Karash bowline.

3. Third level, Shaped eight(?) (three twists), example:Your original post bowline.

It seems that you have advanced from first to third, and i was curious about the second.

Would a karash bowline, enhanced with your locking mechanism, meet your security standards?

As you see, i meant downgrading the complexity by one order/level.
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SS369

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Re: QuasiLocked Eye Knot
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2024, 10:39:00 PM »
I understand what you are saying now.

Yes the Karash single eye would benefit with the tail locking, as will many others. Some bends as well.
I have tried too many to document. Pretty much any suitable knots requiring more security will benefit.

Downgrading the complexity won't be what I have brought to discuss. ;-)

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